呼吸道浑浊（我的血液酒精浓度很好）

[upinsmoke]

correct, will be taking my 3rd dose this Tuesday coming up and the weight is still steadily dropping

I have been searching for threads when it comes to cloudiness and potential fixes and what not. This is all still pretty new to me, so trying to prepare for situations that may come up.

I have some stuff stored that my subjects need to start, and would prefer sooner rather than later, but I have decided that until I have the stuff to filter properly, it can wait. Which is on it's way, stuck in bloody customs.

But pinning cloudy stuff, is next level gutsy in my opinion. Courage on another level !!! That's not in a bad way, that's more like "Not all heroes wear capes" way. .

Like they say, you eat with your eyes. That's sort of me. Could be the best tasting stuff you ever eat, but if it looks like turd on a plate, I'm about 80% mind made up. When it comes to subject testing and seeing it cloudy without a fix. I'm pretty much got my mind made up that I am cutting losses.

!00% applaud the dedication.

 

[igottapee]

trash that kit! not worth the risk if they're sending you a new one

Probably would have been safer to have it tested first before using

 

[Nerker]

Watching the ERP TG // PBS talk also. Got some RT20's coming. Will advise when I recon.

 

[Jone5y87!]

Is is still safe to pin if cloudy ?

 

[GusGustavson]

Commenting because I saw other people mentioning this problem too.

Some science behind it. Maybe interesting for others who have had this happen or if it ever happens in the future. The cloudiness is likely a pH problem. The peptide likely has residual TFA salts from manufacturing that should not be there, and when BAC water is added the combined acidity lands right on retatrutide's isoelectric point. The molecules lose their charge, clump together, and crash out of solution. That's the cloud.

The simplest thing to rule out is the BAC water itself. Hospira's own spec allows pH from 4.5 to 7.0, which is a huge range. A bottle sitting at the low end will crash TFA laden peptide while a bottle at the high end might reconstitute it perfectly clear.

Trying BAC water from a different supplier or at least a different production lot is the most practical first step before reaching for any other options. With pH strips it is possible to compare different BAC bottles and see if it explains the cloudiness.

Also worth noting that Hospira is one of the most counterfeited medical products out there. If it's fake and actually contains sodium chloride, that causes a whole different precipitation problem, and switching supplier would immediately reveal that.

And filtering a cloudy solution removes the peptide itself, not some contaminant. That cloud IS the retatrutide. A significant portion of the dose can be lost with no way of knowing how much. Filtering only makes sense after the solution has already been cleared through a pH correction, to remove the small fraction of irreversible aggregates.

The PBS rescue not staying clear is because aggregate seeds formed while the peptide sat at the wrong pH. Those seeds act as templates that slowly pull dissolved peptide back out of solution. Adding more PBS won't fix that because it's a structural problem not a pH problem at that point.

Acetic acid can make it look clear but the initial clumping that was visible was further aggregation before redissolving. Some peptide was likely damaged irreversibly, and the solution is now in a more acidic environment that degrades it faster over time.

The longer a reconstituted peptide sits at the wrong pH the more irreversible damage accumulates.

Worth keeping in mind that a reship from the same vendor doesn't necessarily solve anything if the replacement comes from the same batch. The TFA salt issue is at the production level, not the individual vial level. If the washing step was insufficient for that batch, every vial from it carries the same excess TFA. Whether it shows as cloudiness can depend on where your BAC water lands on the pH scale.

Would I use cloudy solution? No.

Aggregated peptide can train the immune system to recognize that peptide as a threat. Once antibodies develop against it, they can neutralize not just the aggregated form but also properly dissolved peptide in future injections. Pinning cloudy product can in theory make clean product less effective later.

 

[RetaScrub]

I did some more research and it seems the peptide is fine after PBS. I wanted to know: where do the TFA salts actually go? I found a technical analysis of what the salts do to the peptide, and it sounds like nothing, once the environment is corrected. I'm not a chemist, so I ran it through an AI and got this summary:

1. Residual TFA is the hidden problem

• During peptide manufacturing, TFA (trifluoroacetic acid) is commonly used

• Some of it stays behind as TFA salts

• If not properly removed:

the peptide powder is acidic

⸻

2. When you add BAC water → pH crashes

• BAC water pH ≈ 5.7

• Add residual TFA → drops to ~4–4.5

That matters because:

• Reta’s isoelectric point (pI) ≈ 6

• Near that point → peptides lose charge

• When they lose charge → they clump together

Result:

cloudiness / flakes (“snowflakes”)

⸻

3. Salt and solvent effects worsen it

He explains three environments:

Filtered water

• No buffering → unstable → can crash

BAC water

• Alcohol reduces solubility

• pH too close to pI → aggregation

Saline

• “salting out” effect

• pushes molecules together → precipitation

⸻

His solution

Use PBS (phosphate-buffered saline)

Why?

• PBS buffers pH at ~7.4

• keeps you away from the pI danger zone

• neutralizes residual acid (TFA)

• stabilizes the peptide in solution

Your peptide is fine — it’s just crashing out because the environment is wrong.

Fix the environment → it stays clear.

This is my question as well. I understand the TFA is neutralized at the higher pH from the PBS, but wouldn’t the TFA still be present, and still have some injection risk?

 

[Chili777]

This is my question as well. I understand the TFA is neutralized at the higher pH from the PBS, but wouldn’t the TFA still be present, and still have some injection risk?

这也是我剩下的疑问。你可能会觉得改善环境并非解决问题的全部，但Gemini是这么说的。我需要问问我认识的一位化学家，让他解释一下。

 

[RetCurious]

正如预期的那样，这是后处理过程中残留的TFA盐。

你说的是TFA盐？

德国化学品管理局向欧盟提交提案，将TFA与生殖毒性联系起来。

德国化学品管理局向欧盟提交提案，将反式脂肪酸与生殖毒性联系起来

TFA 是 HFO-1234yf 和其他 f 类气体的大气副产物，科学家认为它是一种会在环境中持续存在的 PFAS。

naturalrefrigernants.com

 

[agussie]

你说的是TFA盐？

德国化学品管理局向欧盟提交提案，将TFA与生殖毒性联系起来。

德国化学品管理局向欧盟提交提案，将反式脂肪酸与生殖毒性联系起来

TFA 是 HFO-1234yf 和其他 f 类气体的大气副产物，科学家认为它是一种会在环境中持续存在的 PFAS。

naturalrefrigernants.com

我的意思是，它们无处不在，包括雨水、湖泊等等。我同意，它们不被认为是好的，因为它们与其它永久性化学物质 PFAS 属于同一类。

 

[RetCurious]

我的意思是，它们无处不在，包括雨水、湖泊等等。我同意，它们不被认为是好的，因为它们与其它永久性化学物质 PFAS 属于同一类。

你认为礼来公司在其产品生产过程中会使用三氟乙酸（TFA）吗？

看起来他们很可能使用了。

“为了确保不会发生不必要的化学反应，会创建所谓的‘化学锁’，这些化学锁需要在生产过程结束时被移除。在几乎所有肽合成过程中，用于移除这些‘化学锁’的物质都是三氟乙酸。”

PFAS 可用于合成治疗性肽 - FPP4EU

治疗性肽是一种很有前途的新型疗法，可用于治疗包括癌症、心血管疾病和自身免疫性疾病在内的多种疾病。

www.fpp4eu.eu

 

[RetCurious]

或许我应该问问礼来公司是否有相应的检查措施来防止TFA污染？

我的意思是，即使肉眼可见的症状可以消除，我也不会故意把这种东西注射到体内，因为它并不能根除问题。