Anyone making their own bac water?

[JulezZ]

Hi! I'm annoyed and confused at how you can't just buy bac water at pharmacies. I mean – just why?!? I'm now considering buying sterile injection water and just adding benzyl alcohol with a sterile syringe. Sounds doable in theory. Has anyone done that, or knows why that would be a horrible idea?

 

[retarequired]

You'd have to find injection grade benzyl alcohol which I think is hard to source!

Peter Magic from Janoshik did an interview and if I remember correctly he said you can just use sterile water or saline. If you do go that route definitely filter and keep them in the fridge though.

I think this is probably a safer route than adding non injection grade benzyl alcohol, but I have heard of people that do it.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shgk3-u51Ys&t

41:30

 

[BasharTeg]

Actually, injection grade BA is not especially hard to find, at least if you are in the EU.

For example, I have ordered it from the Netherlands (injection grade, ph. Eur, USP), easily found using your web search engine of choice.

They have bottles starting at 100ml, all the way up to 25 litres

So, I have bought my BA there (100ml one is going to last me forever, or for at least 2-3 years until BA starts to oxidize, then I will just order another one), made my own BAC water with sterile injection water (also easily found in Germany), for basically pennies.

Everything reconned crystal clear and survived weeks on end with no problems whatsoever.

 

[retarequired]

Actually, injection grade BA is not especially hard to find, at least if you are in the EU.

For example, I have ordered it from the Netherlands (injection grade, ph. Eur, USP), easily found using your web search engine of choice.

They have bottles starting at 100ml, all the way up to 25 litres

I must have overlooked it the first time I looked into it! I see it is indeed injection grade now. My baddd

 

[dazedconfused_]

Actually, injection grade BA is not especially hard to find, at least if you are in the EU.

For example, I have ordered it from the Netherlands (injection grade, ph. Eur, USP), easily found using your web search engine of choice.

They have bottles starting at 100ml, all the way up to 25 litres

So, I have bought my BA there (100ml one is going to last me forever, or for at least 2-3 years until BA starts to oxidize, then I will just order another one), made my own BAC water with sterile injection water (also easily found in Germany), for basically pennies.

Everything reconned crystal clear and survived weeks on end with no problems whatsoever.

What's your process like? Would you consider it being sterile?

Getting BAC in Germany seems to become harder and harder. So I'm considering either using just sterile water or adding BA to it myself. But that again I somehow find risky? Ha, not sure.

 

[BasharTeg]

What's your process like? Would you consider it being sterile?

Getting BAC in Germany seems to become harder and harder. So I'm considering either using just sterile water or adding BA to it myself. But that again I somehow find risky? Ha, not sure.

Process is, first you get injection sterile water and ph.Eur/USP injection grade BA.

I am using a sterile injection water easily obtainable here (comes in packs of 20 bottles with 10, 20, 50, 100ml and so on, I prefer the versions of 20ml or more, they come in glass bottles, 10ml version comes in plastic ampules, and 10ml is anyway not much). For example, the one I am using (not sure if brands are allowed here, having post rejected all the time), a pack of 20x20ml costs something like 6 Euro, available in countless real and online pharmacies in Germany (and hence, in the EU).

BA I am getting from the lab supplies in the Netherlands. The smallest bottle you can get there is 100ml (iirc), but anything from 20-50ml or so will do the trick, and will last you forever (or at least for 2 years, until BA starts to oxidize in the opened BA bottle, and thus becomes less effective. After 2 or so years, you simply order a new one.

Then, get a sterile insulin syringes you would use for reconning, pull what amounts to 0.9-1% of BA for your bottle of sterile injection water (for example, get 1ml of BA for 100ml water bottle, 0.45-0.5ml of BA for 50ml bottle and so on.

No need to be super precise with BA amount, people are putting everything from 0.8% to 1.8% of BA and doing just fine. Also, branded BAC waters also vary in BA content `for as much as 0.2% or more from batch to batch, so no difference there.

Once you get the proper amount of BA in your syringe, put it in the sterile water, shake it around for some time to spread the BA around. That's it, you have got yourself selfmade BAC for basically pennies

As I wrote above, get your ph.Eur grade BA from the Netherlands (or from somewhere else, it's not the only place, of course), smallest bottle of 20, 50 or 100ml will last you years

It is not less sterile than, for example, reconning and filling up cartridges for the injection pens, like V1s, V2s, Savvio, GensulinPen2, Novo...

 

[Sid the SeaGull]

Somewhat interesting, how sterile it is may be a concern but at least it's a variable you can control.

Have you considered having yours tested ? It would be interesting to see a kind test between your homebrew BAC mix and Hospita .

 

[BasharTeg]

Somewhat interesting, how sterile it is may be a concern but at least it's a variable you can control.

Have you considered having yours tested ? It would be interesting to see a kind test between your homebrew BAC mix and Hospita .

Well, I am testing the pH value of it with pH stripes (fairly accurate ones with 4-9 and 4-7 ranges, with 0.25 steps), always had 5.75 as the result, which is pretty much spot on, at least for the most common peptides.

I don't plan to do any real lab testing, simply because, so far, I have never had any problems whatsoever reconnig stuff with my selfmade water

And, also never had any bacteria development in reconned vials either, even after more than 7 weeks storage and usage too, meaning I have pulled out reconned peptides out of the vial at least 7-8 times in those 7 weeks. Pulling out is, of course, not 100% sterile, despite efforts in swabbing the vial tops, but there is nothing one can do about it realistically), so BA in the water did its job perfectly

 

[MisterM.]

@BasharTeg

Hi im also from Germany, nice to see here People from the same Region. I have now also the same Issue my last BAC is now used and i need replenishment.

I have used 2 times China BAC for a test with Tirz but both times i got heavy Side Effects(Heart Racing/feeling sick ect.) from someone. I will exclude that it depends on the BAC Water.

For this Reason i ordered Saline NaCL Injectionwater? Any Reason why you didn´t use it? And what will be the better Solution NaCL oder Ampuwa with BA for rec. of Tirz?

 

[BasharTeg]

@BasharTeg

Hi im also from Germany, nice to see here People from the same Region. I have now also the same Issue my last BAC is now used and i need replenishment.

I have used 2 times China BAC for a test with Tirz but both times i got heavy Side Effects(Heart Racing/feeling sick ect.) from someone. I will exclude that it depends on the BAC Water.

For this Reason i ordered Saline NaCL Injectionwater? Any Reason why you didn´t use it? And what will be the better Solution NaCL oder Ampuwa with BA for rec. of Tirz?

You do not need or should use NaCl water for reconning peptides.

It will either react with the buffer stuff used during lyophilization process, or it will react with peptides you are trying to recon.

For example, Reta will likely react with Sodium (deutsch: Natrium) and become spoiled, i.e. less effective or even completely ineffective. Other peptides may jelly up, or congregate (develop "floaties") or become "cloudy", or any combination of the unwanted effects listed. I find that the not-obvious-adverse-effects like no floaties or jelly or cloudy recon, but having the peptide less potent or completely neutralized actually the worst outcome, because it's not visible or detectable, other than it then having less or no effect when injected (which is not always so easy to gauge).

The acidic residues in the buffer of lyophilized peptide will react with salts (needless to say, NaCl is a salt), and undergo hydrolysis of those residues, which would render a lot of peptides ineffective due to damaged cell signaling mechanisms.

You do not want any of that, obviously

Just use Ampuwa or other sterile injection grade water plus BA and you will be ok

Edit: Yes, some peptides from some batches may have zero or not many detectable or obvious effects from using NaCl for reconning. But why would anyone gamble with that, when NaCl brings literally nothing to the table, whereas both BA & sterile injection water are readily available and are basically dirt cheap?

Other than making your own BAC water, the remaining option is to use something proven and branded, like Hospira or Lambda BAC water. Anything else is a lottery and gamble, and one you are bound to lose in most cases.

 

[cat_walk]

Hi France based here. I went home-made BAC since 3 months. I use it to reconstitute tirze, reta, klow and nad+.

So far so good. No more "where in the world is Hospira" anxiety.

 

[AlexSilver]

You do not need or should use NaCl water for reconning peptides.

It will either react with the buffer stuff used during lyophilization process, or it will react with peptides you are trying to recon.

For example, Reta will likely react with Sodium (deutsch: Natrium) and become spoiled, i.e. less effective or even completely ineffective. Other peptides may jelly up, or congregate (develop "floaties") or become "cloudy", or any combination of the unwanted effects listed. I find that the not-obvious-adverse-effects like no floaties or jelly or cloudy recon, but having the peptide less potent or completely neutralized actually the worst outcome, because it's not visible or detectable, other than it then having less or no effect when injected (which is not always so easy to gauge).

The acidic residues in the buffer of lyophilized peptide will react with salts (needless to say, NaCl is a salt), and undergo hydrolysis of those residues, which would render a lot of peptides ineffective due to damaged cell signaling mechanisms.

You do not want any of that, obviously

Just use Ampuwa or other sterile injection grade water plus BA and you will be ok

Edit: Yes, some peptides from some batches may have zero or not many detectable or obvious effects from using NaCl for reconning. But why would anyone gamble with that, when NaCl brings literally nothing to the table, whereas both BA & sterile injection water are readily available and are basically dirt cheap?

Other than making your own BAC water, the remaining option is to use something proven and branded, like Hospira or Lambda BAC water. Anything else is a lottery and gamble, and one you are bound to lose in most cases.

This is incorrect. PBS is the recommended solution for reconstituting Tirz. It’s what the Chinese reps call “WA water” and monjourno pens direct from lily even come reconstituted with PBS (and a little hcl to balance the ph)

but always use BAC water for Retatrutide.

 

[BasharTeg]

This is incorrect. PBS is the recommended solution for reconstituting Tirz. It’s what the Chinese reps call “WA water” and monjourno pens direct from lily even come reconstituted with PBS (and a little hcl to balance the ph)

View attachment 18889

but always use BAC water for Retatrutide.

As I said, every peptide is different and will react differently.

Also, my example was Reta, not Tirz. Reta will most definitely react with salts. Tirz probably too, but exactly how and how much, I don't know. Also, not all salts are the same and all of them will have different effects on different peptides, buffers, residue in buffers, batches, and so on. Some may be ok, some not. Which will ahve what effect, is quite ahrd to know. Do a comprehensive peer reviewed research, and you may publish quite a few papers on this

Furthermore, Tirz absolutely needs not be dissolved in PBS (which is also not the same as NaCl water), but it can. However, it will perfectly recon in a typical sterile injection water too (with or without BA), so what improvement does PBS brings for Tirz reconning?

If the pH of the recon sterile water one uses is too low (i.e. too acidic), adding a touch of PBS solution may help, to increase pH. But what has that to do with NaCl water?

Also, MJ reconned solution in official MJ pens contains much more than just water, some PBS and Tirz, it has loads of various preservatives and also loads of other proprietary stuff, to let it live for months and years reconned in a pen...

But as always, everyone and anyone is free to do whatever they believe and/or find it works for them, so YMMV

 

[AlexSilver]

As I said, every peptide is different and will react differently.

Also, my example was Reta, not Tirz. Reta will most definitely react with salts. Tirz probably too, but exactly how and how much, I don't know. Also, not all salts are the same and all of them will have different effects on different peptides, buffers, residue in buffers, batches, and so on. Some may be ok, some not. Which will ahve what effect, is quite ahrd to know. Do a comprehensive peer reviewed research, and you may publish quite a few papers on this

Furthermore, Tirz absolutely needs not be dissolved in PBS (which is also not the same as NaCl water), but it can. However, it will perfectly recon in a typical sterile injection water too (with or without BA), so what improvement does PBS brings for Tirz reconning?

If the pH of the recon sterile water one uses is too low (i.e. too acidic), adding a touch of PBS solution may help, to increase pH. But what has that to do with NaCl water?

Also, MJ reconned solution in official MJ pens contains much more than just water, some PBS and Tirz, it has loads of various preservatives and also loads of other proprietary stuff, to let it live for months and years reconned in a pen...

But as always, everyone and anyone is free to do whatever they believe and/or find it works for them, so YMMV

PBS is Phosphate Buffered Saline aka NaCl plus the buffering agent, sodium phosphate dibasic heptahydrate.

 

[MisterM.]

So im a bit confused now. I think Janoshik was reconmending NaCL in Europe for reconstr. of Peptides. In his Video he told that it is a good alternative to the BAC Water which is more difficult to get it in Europe and more expensive?

 

[Vash_]

Hi! I'm annoyed and confused at how you can't just buy bac water at pharmacies. I mean – just why?!? I'm now considering buying sterile injection water and just adding benzyl alcohol with a sterile syringe. Sounds doable in theory. Has anyone done that, or knows why that would be a horrible idea?

I’ve thought about it but, it’s so cheap to just buy by the bottle online. Also seems like you’d end up making large batches that would just sit around. One 30ml bottle is already more than I need. And I’m taking four different peps.

 

[anhydrous]

So im a bit confused now. I think Janoshik was reconmending NaCL in Europe for reconstr. of Peptides. In his Video he told that it is a good alternative to the BAC Water which is more difficult to get it in Europe and more expensive?

If given the choice I would choose sodium chloride injection over sterile water for injection because it is isotonic. Having said that, it pays to know what you're doing as it is incompatible with certain drugs like CNS and cardiovascular agents.

 

[dazedconfused_]

So im a bit confused now. I think Janoshik was reconmending NaCL in Europe for reconstr. of Peptides. In his Video he told that it is a good alternative to the BAC Water which is more difficult to get it in Europe and more expensive?

Wasn't it sterile water he said is fine to use, not NaCl?

In which case one might as well just add BA and good to go

 

[UncrossSelector]

Somewhat interesting, how sterile it is may be a concern but at least it's a variable you can control.

Have you considered having yours tested ? It would be interesting to see a kind test between your homebrew BAC mix and Hospita .

I do a different process.

I add sterile water to the peptide vial. Then I add a little bac with a fresh syringe. (Obviously calculated).

I use the 10ml ampoules of water and throw whatever is left out.

That way I’m not risking making bad BAC and using it across many vials.

But I only bother when I’m out of Hospira.

 

[ESSO88]

Is this an EU thing? BAC is readily available online in AUS, can even get it on Amazon