Not Good - Gaining on 15 mg Tirz

[Spork]

Don't hate, that's almost assuredly the issue. Some combination of more calories in or less calories out. The fix is to eat less or move more. To eat less, use more medicine, more tracking/conscious effort, or a combination.

That's a 40% increase in effective weekly dose. That's 15mg to 21mg.

40% isn't a ton

I guess this is to say, given the continuation of higher-dose clinical trials (they haven't ceased due to safety issues) and the approval of 7.2mg doses of semaglutide, this would certainly be a safe enough thing to try and to just see if there's a problem with side effects.

 

[finesse]

You body has adapted and you have a lower metabolic rate I.e., you are eating much much more than you needs to survive.

You need to find out your TDEE and then reduce it to determine what is needed to lose weight.

 

[woundcarping]

40% isn't a ton

I guess this is to say, given the continuation of higher-dose clinical trials (they haven't ceased due to safety issues) and the approval of 7.2mg doses of semaglutide, this would certainly be a safe enough thing to try and to just see if there's a problem with side effects.

The prior escalation from 12.5mg to 15mg is 20%, going from 7 day pins to 5 day would be double that increase.

I'm not afraid of going beyond trialed dosing, I spent months taking 18-20mg of Reta weekly. I wouldn't take a 40% increase as a cautious, front line experimental fix for gaining 10lb over 180 days.

 

[Laxfinity]

Sema is the only one of all 3 that I am on/have tried that ever stops food noise for me. I would suggest starting with .25 and going from there. I have cagri but never did it because sema took care of it. I started on Ozempic 4 years ago.. so it is the "OG" for me.

 

[Just A Cat]

This is everyone's greatest fear.

It is also, for better or for worst, why I keep getting on the soapbox about using the time that you are actually losing weight to make those new habits, that new lifestyle that will help you in the future. Not only will it help you to lose the weight better, but those changes will help you keep it off better, easier, longer when you go into maintenance.

We are looking at a complicated chaotic system. We have to work with nutrition, biology, the micro-biome, and the normal human tendency to return to old habits.

Complicated... but I will try to sum it up simply as this.

Make some new habits. Otherwise you will return to those old habits, which is what made the old you.

 

[When_Pigs_Fly]

first of all, I am very sorry you are experiencing this, I know that it is probably causing a lot of anxiety because you dont want to ever go back to where you came from. six months is a pretty long time, but those pounds can creep on slowly. That's how I gained, and didnt really see it happening. So, I think after you lose weight, your body not only has a muscle memory, but also a fat memory and it will quickly betray you if you even slip up slightly! That is cruel, but luckily, we do have some tools to help! I think this could be a perfect case for adding Reta because that raises metabolic rate a bit? Also, have you been stressed? Cortisol changes? Sleeping ok? If I wanted to take action TODAY: I think id commit to a week of very clean eating and see if adding reta would give you a boost in the right direction again. Dont beat yourself up over it tho, sounds like you are already making the commitment to rein it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back makes me sound so patronizing. trying to be supportive, sorry if it sounds like complete douchebaggery and wishing u the best!

You

Similar stage and my weight loss has been in dribbles over the last few months. 2 weeks ago I upped to 15mg, hoping for a boost, but nothing noticeable at all. I was jabbing every 6 days.

This past week I decided to mix things up a bit....dropped my dose back to 12.5 but jabbed at day 5, not 6, moving to a 5 day rotation. At 12.5 every 5 days vs 15 every 6 days it should essentially maintain same med level, six of one, etc.

But, to my utter shock, I'm suddenly dropping weight DAILY, 3 pounds in 3 days! I have no explanation for this. I did, at the same time, add an electrolyte to my life, but that's the only other thing that changed.

I can't explain this, just putting it out there for you as a data point.

thanks. Super helpful

 

[When_Pigs_Fly]

first of all, I am very sorry you are experiencing this, I know that it is probably causing a lot of anxiety because you dont want to ever go back to where you came from. six months is a pretty long time, but those pounds can creep on slowly. That's how I gained, and didnt really see it happening. So, I think after you lose weight, your body not only has a muscle memory, but also a fat memory and it will quickly betray you if you even slip up slightly! That is cruel, but luckily, we do have some tools to help! I think this could be a perfect case for adding Reta because that raises metabolic rate a bit? Also, have you been stressed? Cortisol changes? Sleeping ok? If I wanted to take action TODAY: I think id commit to a week of very clean eating and see if adding reta would give you a boost in the right direction again. Dont beat yourself up over it tho, sounds like you are already making the commitment to rein it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back makes me sound so patronizing. trying to be supportive, sorry if it sounds like complete douchebaggery and wishing u the best!

You

first of all, I am very sorry you are experiencing this, I know that it is probably causing a lot of anxiety because you dont want to ever go back to where you came from. six months is a pretty long time, but those pounds can creep on slowly. That's how I gained, and didnt really see it happening. So, I think after you lose weight, your body not only has a muscle memory, but also a fat memory and it will quickly betray you if you even slip up slightly! That is cruel, but luckily, we do have some tools to help! I think this could be a perfect case for adding Reta because that raises metabolic rate a bit? Also, have you been stressed? Cortisol changes? Sleeping ok? If I wanted to take action TODAY: I think id commit to a week of very clean eating and see if adding reta would give you a boost in the right direction again. Dont beat yourself up over it tho, sounds like you are already making the commitment to rein it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back makes me sound so patronizing. trying to be supportive, sorry if it sounds like complete douchebaggery and wishing u the best!

thanks for the great reply. It really is f’ing w my mind (again - as if food alone isn’t enough to do that!). I hear that you get it. Thanks for the support.

 

[HereKittyKitty]

I stack Tirz with Survo. It's been really good for me and keeps my Tirz runway intact. Every 6 days, 3 day offset.

Tried cagri. Probably coincidental but I got really sick for 24 hours after my first dose. Couldn't bring myself to try it again. It was a harrowing second day of vacation last year.

 

[quicksilver80]

Unless you have a glucagon agonist these drugs dont really help with weightloss. It ultimately boils down to calories in and work output. I was cycling 24 miles a day and that shit didnt matter until i dropped my food intake. Then the weight practically melted off.

 

[woundcarping]

Unless you have a glucagon agonist these drugs dont really help with weightloss.

[Imported image pending local asset: attachments-img_2158-gif.35326]

 

[staffn1]

You mentioned no change with exercise. How is your strength training? If just cardio the body gets more efficient and you burn less calories over time. Combined with muscle loss on calorie deficit makes weight increases with no change to diet and activity very possible.

 

[ladyj779]

View attachment 35326

True but after that, what he says is correct. You have to eat less than your body needs to lose weight.

I presumed he meant that unless you are augmenting burn with glucagon agonist, so you get a little bit of caloric leeway, you gotta put the fork down.

But this gif will never not be

 

[Skidude]

True but after that, what he says is correct. You have to eat less than your body needs to lose weight.

I presumed he meant that unless you are augmenting burn with glucagon agonist, so you get a little bit of caloric leeway, you gotta put the fork down.

But this gif will never not be

I did not get the way I was by putting the fork down when I was full.. I loved to eat for sport!

Not until I was full.. until I was tired..

If I wanted, I could out eat these peps.. I know it.. it would hurt though

 

[ladyj779]

I did not get the way I was by putting the fork down when I was full.. I loved to eat for sport!

Not until I was full.. until I was tired..

If I wanted, I could out eat these peps.. I know it.. it would hurt though

I have to count calories. Every day. Even on the glps. The difference now is I'm not hungry.

65+lbs down in 177 days. I'm really good at counting calories. I am active.

But I could absolutely still eat

 

[quicksilver80]

View attachment 35326

I mean it stops you from being hungry its not burning calories in itself.

 

[quicksilver80]

True but after that, what he says is correct. You have to eat less than your body needs to lose weight.

I presumed he meant that unless you are augmenting burn with glucagon agonist, so you get a little bit of caloric leeway, you gotta put the fork down.

But this gif will never not be

She speaks me'nglish

 

[lessthanhalf]

I have done every diet, even had RNY, but Tirz nailed the weightloss for me. BUT. The last 6 months I’ve seen a slow increase in my weight despite no change in exercise or calorie intake. Like about 10 pounds over that period (hey, that is slow for me). I think the food noise has returned a bit too. I’m still at 15 mg/week, pinned once a week. I’ve posted about whether I should add Reta or Cagri before but I wanted to take one more shot at getting your all’s opinion or experience on what worked for you. Or do I add sema? I’m pretty confused about the best path forward.

What has your experience been? I’m taking action on this TODAY! I can’t stand this. I can’t bear to go back where I came from.

Thank you in advance.

Sorry this is happening to you. Not sure if it is much consolation, but this seems to be quite uncommon, where weight creeps back up on the same highish dose in maintenance, especially on the same drug and dose that got you there. There are not really too many good explanations for this other than actual tolerance to the effects of the drug, which I would normally say does not really happen, but there is a lot of individual variation in peoples' responses to these drugs and it sounds like you might just be unlucky. I would argue that calorie counting is not really relevant, especially if you did not do that to lose the weight. Maybe if you changed the types of food you ate to more calorie dense ones, you might get more calories in for the same amount of hunger, but in general the drugs are meant to reduce appetite so you eat less and then lose weight.

I tend to think that losing the weight is not the difficult part , it is keeping that weight off over years, when the initial excitement has worn off and life gets in the way. I certainly never succeeded in keeping weight off long term despite several times getting to normal weight before GLP's existed.

Not sure how much weight you lost, but assuming RNY is some type of obesity surgery, ( roux en y ? ) it sounds like you have a serious issue, where the possible risks of higher doses or combos are likely lower than the risks of regaining weight.

I am also in maintenance trying to keep off 80 kilos, I only started the drugs after losing most of the weight, but it is requiring tirz15mg/reta6mg/cagri0.5mg to get close to balancing hunger to maintenance calorie needs of 1600-1900 kcal/day, so far thank god , I have not had any loss in effectiveness over time, I think that would be mildly terrifying.

Sounds like you already have a fair idea of what your options are, in a lot of ways it probably does not make that much difference what you chose, and is going to come down to what option is going to be most effective with the least side effects. But elora, cagri or adding in reta are all reasonable options, you might have to just try one and see how it works. In theory elora might be the best choice, but it is not very available and more expensive, but did cause an extra 11% weight loss added to tirz over 32 weeks at 9mg, and more or less the only one with any direct human study evidence as an add on to tirz. I picked reta to add to tirz as elora was not available a year ago, and I had very few side effects from tirz and did not want to mess that up by swapping, so just added in a bit of reta for the extra glp/gip plus the glucagon agonism , that could cause an extra 100 kcal/day of free extra energy expenditure.

 

[HereKittyKitty]

RNY is Roux en Y, yes.

Anyone can gain 100# one M&M at a time.

 

[ThatNextGril]

Similar stage and my weight loss has been in dribbles over the last few months. 2 weeks ago I upped to 15mg, hoping for a boost, but nothing noticeable at all. I was jabbing every 6 days.

This past week I decided to mix things up a bit....dropped my dose back to 12.5 but jabbed at day 5, not 6, moving to a 5 day rotation. At 12.5 every 5 days vs 15 every 6 days it should essentially maintain same med level, six of one, etc.

But, to my utter shock, I'm suddenly dropping weight DAILY, 3 pounds in 3 days! I have no explanation for this. I did, at the same time, add an electrolyte to my life, but that's the only other thing that changed.

I can't explain this, just putting it out there for you as a data point.

Oh interesting! I'm going to try this, too. I'm in the same boat as you. I only have like maybe ~10 pounds til goal and it's just been so frustrating to see to see my scale at essential the same weight for 13 months now. I tried adding reta in with the tirz for about 8 weeks at the beginning of the year, but I just could not stand the raised RHR and bad sleep that came with the reta. I've been thinking about pinning my current 15mg of tirz every 6 days, but I like the idea that maybe for the heck of it I try your 5 day rota at the lower 12.5 dose. Anything to break the stall would be welcome (and I love and trust my tirz, and want to try still using it before trying elora or cagri or something else).

 

[spanky2026]

Oh interesting! I'm going to try this, too. I'm in the same boat as you. I only have like maybe ~10 pounds til goal and it's just been so frustrating to see to see my scale at essential the same weight for 13 months now. I tried adding reta in with the tirz for about 8 weeks at the beginning of the year, but I just could not stand the raised RHR and bad sleep that came with the reta. I've been thinking about pinning my current 15mg of tirz every 6 days, but I like the idea that maybe for the heck of it I try your 5 day rota at the lower 12.5 dose. Anything to break the stall would be welcome (and I love and trust my tirz, and want to try still using it before trying elora or cagri or something else).

Lemme know if it works for you