Dogmandu said:
HGH and RT: the best combination?
- Thread starter Omxxl
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Omxxl, I am curious, how old are you? I guess if I am aking your age it would be proper for me to share my age....54.Omxxl said:
From Meso, arguing that tirz can be better than reta for mitigating HGH insulin resistance:
https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hgh-retatrutide.134432735/post-3616609
Similarly:
https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hgh-retatrutide.134432735/post-3616609
Ghoul said:
Similarly:
Gemini said:
I understood that HGH made you insulin resistant, while Reta does the opposite, so the synergy is greater. They also complement each other in fat oxidation. What is certain is that a high intake of carbohydrates and protein is necessary, along with serious weight training.
I've seen several fitness and bodybuilding enthusiasts use it in their protocols with considerable success. Nick Walker was one of those who spoke about Reta.
I've seen several fitness and bodybuilding enthusiasts use it in their protocols with considerable success. Nick Walker was one of those who spoke about Reta.
All the bros are on reta and HGH. So it's just shocking to see anyone on Meso mentioning tirz, but Ghoul there is my favorite poster by far, so I'm not surprised he was the one who mentioned it.
They are often on higher doses of HGH over there, along with everything else they take (like up to a gram of steroids a week). A lot of the guys there look great, but it's YOLO dosing as the norm there (great for selling life insurance).
So if we are inspired to be on HGH because of the bro culture, we need to be careful, since even some at Meso think HGH is overrated:
"Is this just a big circle jerk?"
For some entertaining bro science:
https://www.thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hgh-high-dosing.134426854/post-3343715
What I like about the GH peptides the most is they motivate me to eat less by fasting around their administration. And I do take them for "recovery," but I don't know how much it helps. From the studies I remember, they may be good for the brain too, if not overdoing it. But so is exercise, etc.
They are often on higher doses of HGH over there, along with everything else they take (like up to a gram of steroids a week). A lot of the guys there look great, but it's YOLO dosing as the norm there (great for selling life insurance).
So if we are inspired to be on HGH because of the bro culture, we need to be careful, since even some at Meso think HGH is overrated:
"Is this just a big circle jerk?"
For some entertaining bro science:
https://www.thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hgh-high-dosing.134426854/post-3343715
quoted said:
What I like about the GH peptides the most is they motivate me to eat less by fasting around their administration. And I do take them for "recovery," but I don't know how much it helps. From the studies I remember, they may be good for the brain too, if not overdoing it. But so is exercise, etc.
So, 1 week in, I figured id pop a little update in here now.
To be honest, no massive changes - but thats to be expected.
After a few days, I decided to up to 3iu every evening. No major sides, my right wrist is a tiny tiny bit more achy than usual but its so subtle it could have been there before. I suffer with wrist ache anyway, so its not like its appeared overnight.
To preface this, I am using Reta & HGH together and am currently in a cutting phase. However, I do feel like my belly fat is beginning to shrink a bit. Recovery isnt brilliant, but I think thats for other reasons and id like to say that the HGH is helping my recovery, but I have no way of definitively proving that. I am getting some pretty epic pumps in the gym, but again this could be due to upping my carbs slightly.
Im excited to see where this goes!
To be honest, no massive changes - but thats to be expected.
After a few days, I decided to up to 3iu every evening. No major sides, my right wrist is a tiny tiny bit more achy than usual but its so subtle it could have been there before. I suffer with wrist ache anyway, so its not like its appeared overnight.
To preface this, I am using Reta & HGH together and am currently in a cutting phase. However, I do feel like my belly fat is beginning to shrink a bit. Recovery isnt brilliant, but I think thats for other reasons and id like to say that the HGH is helping my recovery, but I have no way of definitively proving that. I am getting some pretty epic pumps in the gym, but again this could be due to upping my carbs slightly.
Im excited to see where this goes!
Another few weeks on!
Now at 4iu, still nightly. This is my peak dose and I wont be going higher, at least I dont think so.
Water retention is still there, and trending upwards unfortunately. This is the downside I have to accept was going to happen, and its not bothering me all that much. I do look 'fuller', which I dont hate. Ive lost some definition, but its manageable. No CT symptoms at all anymore, thank goodness - although it was only very minor, even at its 'worst'.
Bodyfat is still trending downward. Over a 31 day period, my smartwatch has calculated I have gone from 19.1% to ~16%. Weight has stayed broadly similar, as has strength in the gym. Im actually progressing now, even though im in a deficit - body comp, whoop!
This is backed up by skeletal muscle trending upwards. 31.3kg to 32.8kg.
Disclaimer: These figures are provided by my samsung smartwatch, with my weight given by some relatively inexpensive scales. I am consistent in my weigh times though. I focus on trends, not actual numbers, but it makes for an easier explanation using numbers in this context.
Are the figures above 'only' due to HGH, I doubt it. Reta + working out like a hound, will definitely be playing a part here. However, whats really interesting is that the only change in the last month has been the addition of HGH. I have broadly worked out the same amount, with the same exercises, and in the same calorific deficit.
Ill be running HGH for the foreseeable!
Thanks for reading
Now at 4iu, still nightly. This is my peak dose and I wont be going higher, at least I dont think so.
Water retention is still there, and trending upwards unfortunately. This is the downside I have to accept was going to happen, and its not bothering me all that much. I do look 'fuller', which I dont hate. Ive lost some definition, but its manageable. No CT symptoms at all anymore, thank goodness - although it was only very minor, even at its 'worst'.
Bodyfat is still trending downward. Over a 31 day period, my smartwatch has calculated I have gone from 19.1% to ~16%. Weight has stayed broadly similar, as has strength in the gym. Im actually progressing now, even though im in a deficit - body comp, whoop!
This is backed up by skeletal muscle trending upwards. 31.3kg to 32.8kg.
Disclaimer: These figures are provided by my samsung smartwatch, with my weight given by some relatively inexpensive scales. I am consistent in my weigh times though. I focus on trends, not actual numbers, but it makes for an easier explanation using numbers in this context.
Are the figures above 'only' due to HGH, I doubt it. Reta + working out like a hound, will definitely be playing a part here. However, whats really interesting is that the only change in the last month has been the addition of HGH. I have broadly worked out the same amount, with the same exercises, and in the same calorific deficit.
Ill be running HGH for the foreseeable!
Thanks for reading
Just wrapped up my first week on HGH at 2 IU and I’ve already noticed a big improvement in my sleep. I’m dosing first thing in the morning around 5:30 AM.Bunts said:Another few weeks on!
Now at 4iu, still nightly. This is my peak dose and I wont be going higher, at least I dont think so.
Water retention is still there, and trending upwards unfortunately. This is the downside I have to accept was going to happen, and its not bothering me all that much. I do look 'fuller', which I dont hate. Ive lost some definition, but its manageable. No CT symptoms at all anymore, thank goodness - although it was only very minor, even at its 'worst'.
Bodyfat is still trending downward. Over a 31 day period, my smartwatch has calculated I have gone from 19.1% to ~16%. Weight has stayed broadly similar, as has strength in the gym. Im actually progressing now, even though im in a deficit - body comp, whoop!
This is backed up by skeletal muscle trending upwards. 31.3kg to 32.8kg.
Disclaimer: These figures are provided by my samsung smartwatch, with my weight given by some relatively inexpensive scales. I am consistent in my weigh times though. I focus on trends, not actual numbers, but it makes for an easier explanation using numbers in this context.
Are the figures above 'only' due to HGH, I doubt it. Reta + working out like a hound, will definitely be playing a part here. However, whats really interesting is that the only change in the last month has been the addition of HGH. I have broadly worked out the same amount, with the same exercises, and in the same calorific deficit.
Ill be running HGH for the foreseeable!
Thanks for reading
I’m about 15 lbs from my goal weight. The scale is still trending down, just slowly, but my clothes are definitely getting looser, which is encouraging.
So far, I’m really liking how things are going. I think I’ll be on H for the foreseeable future too.
I've read that consistency is more important than when H is taken. Besides, my lifestyle doesn't allow me to take it before bed (evenings) fasted. ius are not mgs, so you definitely will want to understand that before recon. Ai is an excellent resource to help break down the math.Rickcaps said:
Thanks for these write ups. I have been interested in HGH mainly for recovery, but am a bit unsure if I really want to go down this road. I am going to try some of the secretagogues this summer first, but I like reading how it is going for others, especially because you're taking what seems to be reasonable doses.
For what it's worth, and something I forgot to mention in my previous post, sleep hasn't really improved.
I track my sleep with a Samsung smart watch and an Oura ring. Neither have shown to reflect better sleep scores. Odd because lots report better recovery. Its hard to say if I've experience better recovery but I do find I don't get muscle soreness hardly ever now.
I'll keep updating if I remember and people want to know!
I track my sleep with a Samsung smart watch and an Oura ring. Neither have shown to reflect better sleep scores. Odd because lots report better recovery. Its hard to say if I've experience better recovery but I do find I don't get muscle soreness hardly ever now.
I'll keep updating if I remember and people want to know!
Great discussion. Thank you for sharing your journey. I ordered some HGH with the same hopes. I just started TRT about 4 weeks ago, and seeing some nice muscle gains. Started due to low T, not just the gains. But have put on 5lbs of muscle in the last 2 weeks, but less than 1 lb of fat lost.
Planning on starting HGH at 2 iu, was debating at night, as I need some help with sleep, but sounds like am doses still have great effect on sleep. I will try am first and shift to pm if needed. I am trying to reduce my body fat. I have lost 35lbs on sema previously, but switched to Reta about 2 months ago. Not seeing much change on scale, but nice body recomp so far. BF is around 27% right now, and trying to get it below 20% with an ultimate target of 15-17%.
I am 52, and have found putting muscle on very difficult. I have been lifting heavy and consistent for the last year, and even tried a mild bulk phase, but only put on fat, not muscle. TRT has been a game changer for me, looking forward to seeing how HGH will factor in.
Planning on starting HGH at 2 iu, was debating at night, as I need some help with sleep, but sounds like am doses still have great effect on sleep. I will try am first and shift to pm if needed. I am trying to reduce my body fat. I have lost 35lbs on sema previously, but switched to Reta about 2 months ago. Not seeing much change on scale, but nice body recomp so far. BF is around 27% right now, and trying to get it below 20% with an ultimate target of 15-17%.
I am 52, and have found putting muscle on very difficult. I have been lifting heavy and consistent for the last year, and even tried a mild bulk phase, but only put on fat, not muscle. TRT has been a game changer for me, looking forward to seeing how HGH will factor in.
Food for thought:MikeyMike said:
NOTE: Growth hormone is measured in IU (international units) and mg (milligrams):
1 mg = 3 IU
1 IU = 0.33 mg
Starting dose:
• Age below 30 years:
1.2 – 1.5 IU per day (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (may be higher for patients transitioning from pediatric treatment)
• Age 30-60 years:
0.6 – 0.9 IU per day (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)
• Age over 60 years:
0.3 -0.6 IU per day (0.1-0.2 mg/day)
Patient with diabetes or who are susceptible to insulin resistance / glucose intolerance should use the lowest starting dose (0.3 -0.6 IU per day) regardless of age.
Subcutaneous injections are usually administered in the evening to mimic physiologic nocturnal GH secretion.
Dose escalation (titration):
At 1- to 2-month intervals, increase dose in increments of 0.3 -0.6 IU per day (0.1-0.2 mg/day) based on clinical response, blood IGF-1 levels, side effects, and individual considerations such as insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.
Longer time intervals and smaller dose increments may be necessary in older patients.
Goal with GH treatment:
Aim for blood IGF-I levels in the middle of the normal range appropriate for age and sex, unless side effects are significant. Consider a trial of higher GH doses to determine whether this provides further benefit as long as the serum IGF-I levels remain within the normal range and the patient does not experience side effects.
Monitoring:
While IGF-1 levels are not a good indicator of GH status, the usefulness of IGF-1 for monitoring treatment of GH disorders in adulthood is now widely accepted, especially as GH-dosing regimens for growth hormone deficiency have evolved from weight-based dosing (associated with overtreatment and side effects) to individualized dose-titration strategies, which maintain IGF1 within target limits.[7]
At 6-month intervals once maintenance doses are achieved. Monitoring should include clinical evaluation and assessment of side effects, blood IGF-1, fasting blood glucose levels, and T3, T4 and free T4, as well at lipid profile. Quality of life measurements may be done every 6 or 12 months.
Patients on concurrent thyroid, sex hormone or glucocorticoid treatment may need dose adjustments after starting GH replacement therapy.
Factors that may cause a need for higher GH doses:
• Young patients regardless of onset type
• Low blood IGF-1 levels
• Addition of oral estrogen
• Change from transdermal to oral estrogen
• To induce breakdown of stored body fat (lipolysis)
Factors that may cause a need for lower GH doses:
• Elderly patients
• High blood IGF-1 levels
• Discontinuation of oral estrogen
• Change from oral to transdermal estrogen
• Co-treatment with testosterone
• Elevation in fasting blood glucose and/or HbA1c (i.e. worsening glucose tolerance)
Good info. Thanks for the additional info. Certainly something to weigh when deciding starting dose. Could you please provide the source for this info?
How long after starting HGH did you feel effects? I just started so curious as I have read it take 6-12 months to see real progress???Bunts said:Another few weeks on!
Now at 4iu, still nightly. This is my peak dose and I wont be going higher, at least I dont think so.
Water retention is still there, and trending upwards unfortunately. This is the downside I have to accept was going to happen, and its not bothering me all that much. I do look 'fuller', which I dont hate. Ive lost some definition, but its manageable. No CT symptoms at all anymore, thank goodness - although it was only very minor, even at its 'worst'.
Bodyfat is still trending downward. Over a 31 day period, my smartwatch has calculated I have gone from 19.1% to ~16%. Weight has stayed broadly similar, as has strength in the gym. Im actually progressing now, even though im in a deficit - body comp, whoop!
This is backed up by skeletal muscle trending upwards. 31.3kg to 32.8kg.
Disclaimer: These figures are provided by my samsung smartwatch, with my weight given by some relatively inexpensive scales. I am consistent in my weigh times though. I focus on trends, not actual numbers, but it makes for an easier explanation using numbers in this context.
Are the figures above 'only' due to HGH, I doubt it. Reta + working out like a hound, will definitely be playing a part here. However, whats really interesting is that the only change in the last month has been the addition of HGH. I have broadly worked out the same amount, with the same exercises, and in the same calorific deficit.
Ill be running HGH for the foreseeable!
Thanks for reading
I noticed changes at around 3 monthsMTSpace said:
It's chatgpt or some other AI app.MikeyMike said:
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