Depression, and Semax, and SSRIs, oh my!

[bk0004]

Has anyone here had personal experience using  Semax (or other peptides) for depression after SSRIs and herbal remedies failed?

My wife has struggled with mild to moderate depression on and off for years (since middle school). Unfortunately, SSRIs haven't worked well for her, so we're looking into other possibilities.

If you've tried both antidepressants and peptides, how did they compare for you? Recommendations to try or avoid?

I know everyone's experience is different, just hoping to draw off some real-world knowledge from people who've been there.

Thanks in advance!

 

[toologic]

I had no luck with it but I had some mild improvement with PE 22-28

 

[bk0004]

I had no luck with it but I had some mild improvement with PE 22-28

What effects did you notice from the PE 22-28?

 

[Pocket]

I was under the impression that Semax is not as much for mood as much as it is for focus and mental clarity. Selank would be the one for improved mood and anxiety reduction. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Devilseye]

Selank did help me but I took it with an SSRI not instead of. In the end though what helped me most was switching SSRI and taking one in combo with an antipsychotic which has worked really well for me. You can try it, I dont think there is any harm in that just don’t expect miracles. Theres always a placebo effect initially just see if it lasts. Good luck!

 

[toologic]

What effects did you notice from the PE 22-28?

A better mood and less depression. I first started on nasal and then I switched to sub q. Some say the effects should show up in 4 days but for me it was 2 weeks before I noticed it. Have you tried P21?

 

[arborealtrout]

There are sooooooo many antidepressants besides SSRIs

 

[bk0004]

There are sooooooo many antidepressants besides SSRIs

There are lots, yes! But unfortunately SNRIs and TCAs are strictly contraindicated because of heart issues (secondary to an eating disorder in adolescence) and they won't prescribe atypicals like Wellbutrin due to the eating disorder history. So she unfortunately has been restricted to SSRIs.

Luckily the depression is generally mild and we manage. Just hoping to find something for extra support.

 

[arborealtrout]

There are lots, yes! But unfortunately SNRIs and TCAs are strictly contraindicated because of heart issues (secondary to an eating disorder in adolescence) and they won't prescribe atypicals like Wellbutrin due to the eating disorder history. So she unfortunately has been restricted to SSRIs.

Luckily the depression is generally mild and we manage. Just hoping to find something for extra support.

There still remain options besides those. I'm sort of assuming you're in the US. There's a decent handful of FDA-approved things besides what you've mentioned. Brains and science exist worldwide, and it's trivially easy (and usually legal) to import things unavailable in the US, including entire categories (RIMAs being just one example). Drugs do what they do, which is often considerably more than for what they'll ever be approved. Sometimes not seeking depression approval for something that is clearly primarily an antidepressant is just a marketing decision (fluvoxamine, atomoxetine...). Contraindications are relative. When I started my residency, all we had was TCAs and MAOIs. If you were in the CCU post-MI, cardiology would consult us about which TCA you should be on. Generally shouldn't do that these days, but things can be monitored.

 

[lessthanhalf]

I tend to agree that the contraindications issue sounds a little extreme, obviously without knowing precisely what the heart issue is. I am on tricyclics despite heart disease. And unless she is actually underweight avoiding bupropion because of the past history sounds a bit overdramatic, it does cause a little bit of weight loss on average, but not much. And there are snri's not just ssri's.

Even some supplements have evidence of being useful for depression, none have gold standard proof of effectiveness, but many have at least multiple human clinical trials saying they worked and at least low to moderate certainty evidence of efficacy, such as fish oil, l-methylfolate added to ssri's, vitamin d, l-cartinine, and PEA. Plus lots more with varying levels of evidence they work.

 

[bk0004]

There still remain options besides those. I'm sort of assuming you're in the US. There's a decent handful of FDA-approved things besides what you've mentioned. Brains and science exist worldwide, and it's trivially easy (and usually legal) to import things unavailable in the US, including entire categories (RIMAs being just one example). Drugs do what they do, which is often considerably more than for what they'll ever be approved. Sometimes not seeking depression approval for something that is clearly primarily an antidepressant is just a marketing decision (fluvoxamine, atomoxetine...). Contraindications are relative. When I started my residency, all we had was TCAs and MAOIs. If you were in the CCU post-MI, cardiology would consult us about which TCA you should be on. Generally shouldn't do that these days, but things can be monitored.

Okay, I feel like my peptide thread has gotten hijacked and turned into Rx antidepressant recommendations.

I appreciate the suggestions, but this is something we've been dealing with for years. We've done extensive research and have worked with excellent doctors and a psychiatrist whom I trust implicitly.

I didn't come here looking for recommendations to try other antidepressants we've already explored and ruled out.

My spouse and her psychiatrist are considering peptides as the next step, so I came to this peptide forum specifically to hear from people with firsthand experience with peptides. Key PEPTIDES.

Thank you to those who have already commented your experiences. If you've personally used Semax, Selank or other peptides for depression—especially if traditional antidepressants didn't work well for you—I would really appreciate hearing about your experience.

 

[bk0004]

I was under the impression that Semax is not as much for mood as much as it is for focus and mental clarity. Selank would be the one for improved mood and anxiety reduction. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

I'm looking into Selank too! Thanks

 

[bk0004]

A better mood and less depression. I first started on nasal and then I switched to sub q. Some say the effects should show up in 4 days but for me it was 2 weeks before I noticed it. Have you tried P21?

I'll look into it! Thank you.

And no, we haven't tried P21 either

 

[bk0004]

I tend to agree that the contraindications issue sounds a little extreme, obviously without knowing precisely what the heart issue is. I am on tricyclics despite heart disease. And unless she is actually underweight avoiding bupropion because of the past history sounds a bit overdramatic, it does cause a little bit of weight loss on average, but not much. And there are snri's not just ssri's.

Even some supplements have evidence of being useful for depression, none have gold standard proof of effectiveness, but many have at least multiple human clinical trials saying they worked and at least low to moderate certainty evidence of efficacy, such as fish oil, l-methylfolate added to ssri's, vitamin d, l-cartinine, and PEA. Plus lots more with varying levels of evidence they work.

She does take vitamin D and l-carnitine. I'll have to look into PEA, I've never heard it mentioned for depression. Thanks!

 

[bk0004]

Hello, and thank you to everyone who shared suggestions and experiences.

After doing quite a bit more research, we've decided to try stacking Selank, Semax, and possibly P21. I thought I'd document the journey here in case it ends up helping someone else down the road.

The plan is to introduce one at a time so we can identify any reactions or unwanted side effects before adding the next.

Current plan:

Selank

Start at 250 mcg SC

Gradually increase to 500 mcg if well tolerated

Semax

Start at 250 mcg SC

Gradually increase to 500 mcg if well tolerated

P21

After completing the second full cycle of Selank and Semax, evaluate mood and anxiety levels.

Depending on how she's doing, either adjust the current protocol or introduce P21 (intanasal) at that point.

I'll post updates along the way for anyone interested in following the results. Hopefully our experience can help others who are considering a similar approach.

 

[bare_essentials]

I would be interested in your updates please.

 

[Chili777]

I'm ready to start another P21 cycle. It pairs well with Semax and its derivatives. I found it useful. I'm interested in hearing your perspective.

 

[Shittersfull]

My wife has had anxiety and depression for a long time. Semax and selank didn't do much for her, but we will try again. What did help was oxytocin. Made her more in tune with herself and what is important to her.

 

[Jack Paulie]

I had no luck with it but I had some mild improvement with PE 22-28

What dose?

 

[Flash-BCR]

I had no luck with it but I had some mild improvement with PE 22-28

I just ordered some of that last night after seeing it mentioned in this thread…