Any experience with Epitalon + Vilon (or just Vilon)

[Researcher6076]

I replied to your post, but also referenced info about Epitalon and cancer from Researcher6076's post. Sorry for the confusion.

Got it. Found it. Sorry it took a while for me to find the reference. You're absolutely right about the increase in Mouse cancer with vilon in this study. For what it's worth , in the conclusions to the article the researchers concluded that epitalon was protective against cancer. They concluded vilon was not protective against cancer. And they also concluded that the increase in cancer they observed in this genetically modified Mouse population was not representative of violin being a cancer threat. They concluded the increase in cancer was model specific, referring just to these genetically modified mice. But you're very right to bring up the concern.

To the point of my possible research protocols, epitalon + thymalin seem the two peptides of choice for people with aging immune systems that are otherwise generally normal. But epitalon + vilon are the peptides of choice for people with overactive immune systems and autoimmune issues. Modulating the immune system for that population is the intention. The theoretical risk is modulating the immune system of someone with a weak immune system might reduce its ability to detect and destroy precancerous cells.

I look forward to continuing this discussion with all of you. I really enjoy hanging out with some smart people. Now I have all I have to do is find the vilon, it's a bit less available than some of the other peptides.

 

[CNCCurrency]

That's pretty much why I've stuck to the higher dosage. I haven't seen any reliable, research-based evidence that the lower doses are effective, many sources still recommend the higher doses, and there don't seem to be any known adverse effects. If I'm going to the trouble of buying and pinning, I want to be sure, or at least as sure as I can be, that I'm getting the fu

Got it. Found it. Sorry it took a while for me to find the reference. You're absolutely right about the increase in Mouse cancer with vilon in this study. For what it's worth , in the conclusions to the article the researchers concluded that epitalon was protective against cancer. They concluded vilon was not protective against cancer. And they also concluded that the increase in cancer they observed in this genetically modified Mouse population was not representative of violin being a cancer threat. They concluded the increase in cancer was model specific, referring just to these genetically modified mice. But you're very right to bring up the concern.

To the point of my possible research protocols, epitalon + thymalin seem the two peptides of choice for people with aging immune systems that are otherwise generally normal. But epitalon + vilon are the peptides of choice for people with overactive immune systems and autoimmune issues. Modulating the immune system for that population is the intention. The theoretical risk is modulating the immune system of someone with a weak immune system might reduce its ability to detect and destroy precancerous cells.

I look forward to continuing this discussion with all of you. I really enjoy hanging out with some smart people. Now I have all I have to do is find the vilon, it's a bit less available than some of the other peptides.

I never really looked into it deeply, I just skimmed thru it while researching epitalon

Click to expand...

I never really looked into it deeply, I just skimmed thru it while researching epitalon

 

[DjJoshua]

I replied to your post, but also referenced info about Epitalon and cancer from Researcher6076's post. Sorry for the confusion. I’m out in the field with my business, but I will look that up when I get to my office. I know Weinstein was talking about the

I never really looked into it deeply, I just skimmed thru it while researching epitalon

 

[Jfrick11]

It's hard to find a strait, researched answer with dosing for Epitalon. Yes, the early Russian clinical trials started with epitalamin at 10mg/day. But the later Russian trials switched to Epitalon and kept the dose to 10mg day. And because epitalamin is a natural extract there is no reliable dose comparison to Epitalon. Some say 1000:1, but some say 3:1. I have found there is not reliable ratio. Yes, in our community there are lot of dosing claims, but I haven't found any actually tied to repeatable research. And 10mg of Epitalon gets used a lot with no adverse reactions reportee, right? I'm not saying you should use 10mg. Just saying there is legitimate confusion, and no clear answer.

I agree with you that there’s legitimate confusion around Epitalon dosing. The Russian literature isn’t the clearest, especially with the shift from epithalamin, apineal extract, to the isolated tetrapeptide Epitalon while keeping similar milligram dosing.

My reason for mentioning it is that some people jump straight to 10 mg assuming it’s the clearly established dose, when in reality the literature leaves quite a bit of room for interpretation.

Speaking from experience, starting that high didn’t feel great for me. Once I lowered the dose, the experience was completely different.

 

[Camlbacker]

Speaking from experience, starting that high didn’t feel great for me. Once I lowered the dose, the experience was completely different.

How was it different, and how would you go about dosing now, given what you learned?

 

[Researcher6076]

I agree with you that there’s legitimate confusion around Epitalon dosing. The Russian literature isn’t the clearest, especially with the shift from epithalamin, apineal extract, to the isolated tetrapeptide Epitalon while keeping similar milligram dosing.

My reason for mentioning it is that some people jump straight to 10 mg assuming it’s the clearly established dose, when in reality the literature leaves quite a bit of room for interpretation.

Speaking from experience, starting that high didn’t feel great for me. Once I lowered the dose, the experience was completely different.

100% I wouldn't recommend anyone start at 10mg. I ran 1.6mg for 6 days, so a total of 10mg. That worked great for me, no side effects. I wanted for 3 months before running the full 100mg protocol.

The good news is there is great safety hisyory on these peptides. We really need some new clinical trials, but there isn't interest it seems. For sure, no big money to be made with these old widely available peptides.

 

[CNCCurrency]

100% I wouldn't recommend anyone start at 10mg. I ran 1.6mg for 6 days, so a total of 10mg. That worked great for me, no side effects. I wanted for 3 months before running the full 100mg protocol.

The good news is there is great safety hisyory on these peptides. We really need some new clinical trials, but there isn't interest it seems. For sure, no big money to be made with these old widely available peptides.

Research is out there if you look

Aina, F. O., Fadare, J. O., Deji-Dada, O. O., & Agbesanwa, T. A. (2021). Increasing Burden of Aging Population on Health Services Utilization: A Myth or Reality in a Country with Predominantly Young Population. Aging Medicine and Healthcare, 12 (2), 41–45. 10.33879/AMH.122.2020.07023

Al-dulaimi, S., Matta, S., Slijepcevic, P., & Roberts, T. (2024). 5-aza-2′-deoxycytidine induces telomere dysfunction in breast cancer cells. Biomedicine & Pharmacotherapy, 178 , 117173. 10.1016/j.biopha.2024.117173

Anisimov, V. N., & Khavinson, V. K. (2010). Peptide bioregulation of aging: results and prospects. Biogerontology (Dordrecht), 11 (2), 139–149. 10.1007/s10522-009-9249-8

Araj, S. K., Brzezik, J., Mądra-Gackowska, K., & Szeleszczuk, Ł. (2025). Overview of Epitalon—Highly Bioactive Pineal Tetrapeptide with Promising Properties. International Journal of Molecular Sciences, 26 (6), 2691. 10.3390/ijms26062691

Beard, J. R., Officer, A., Carvalho, I. A., Sadana, R., Pot, A. M., Michel, J. P., Lloyd-Sherlock, P., Epping-Jordan, J. E., Peeters, G. M., Mahanani, W. R., Thiyagarajan, J. A., & Chatterij, S. (2016). The World report on ageing and health: a policy framework for healthy ageing.10.1016/S0140-6736(15)00516-4

Bernardes de Jesus, B., & Blasco, M. A. (2013). Telomerase at the intersection of cancer and aging. Trends in Genetics, 29 (9), 513–520. 10.1016/j.tig.2013.06.007

Bernardes de Jesus, B., Vera, E., Schneeberger, K., Tejera, A. M., Ayuso, E., Bosch, F., & Blasco, M. A. (2012). Telomerase gene therapy in adult and old mice delays aging and increases longevity without increasing cancer. EMBO Molecular Medicine, 4 (8), 691–704. 10.1002/emmm.201200245

Bischoff-Ferrari, H. A., Gängler, S., Wieczorek, M., Belsky, D. W., Ryan, J., Kressig, R. W., Stähelin, H. B., Theiler, R., Dawson-Hughes, B., Rizzoli, R., Vellas, B., Rouch, L., Guyonnet, S., Egli, A., Orav, E. J., Willett, W., & Horvath, S. (2025). Individual and additive effects of vitamin D, omega-3 and exercise on DNA methylation clocks of biological aging in older adults from the DO-HEALTH trial. Nature Aging, 5 (3), 376–385. 10.1038/s43587-024-00793-y

Boccardi, V. (2025). From telomeres and senescence to integrated longevity medicine: redefining the path to extended healthspan. Biogerontology (Dordrecht), 26 (3), 107. 10.1007/s10522-025-10246-7

Chung, I., Osterwald, S., Deeg, K. I., & Rippe, K. (2012). PML body meets telomere. Nucleus (Austin, Tex.), 3 (3), 263–275. 10.4161/nucl.20326

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De Vitis, M., Berardinelli, F., & Sgura, A. (2018). Telomere Length Maintenance in Cancer: At the Crossroad between Telomerase and Alternative Lengthening of Telomeres (ALT). International Journal of Molecular Sciences, 19 (2), 606. 10.3390/ijms19020606

Di Micco, R., Krizhanovsky, V., Baker, D., & d’Adda di Fagagna, F. (2021). Cellular senescence in ageing: from mechanisms to therapeutic opportunities. Nature Reviews. Molecular Cell Biology, 22 (2), 75–95. 10.1038/s41580-020-00314-w

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[CNCCurrency]

Research is out there if you look

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Khavinson, V. K., Kormilets, D. Y., & Mar’yanovich, A. T. (2017). Peptides (Epigenetic Regulators) in the Structure of Rodents with a Long and Short Lifespan. Bulletin of Experimental Biology and Medicine, 163(5), 671–676. 10.1007/s10517-017-3876-x

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Khavinson, V. K., Zemchikhina, V. N., Trofimova, S. V., & Malinin, V. V. (2003). Effects of Peptides on Proliferative Activity of Retinal and Pigmented Epithelial Cells. Bulletin of Experimental Biology and Medicine, 135(6), 597–599. 10.1023/A:1025497806636

Khavinson, V., Diomede, F., Mironova, E., Linkova, N., Trofimova, S., Trubiani, O., Caputi, S., & Sinjari, B. (2020). AEDG Peptide (Epitalon) Stimulates Gene Expression and Protein Synthesis during Neurogenesis: Possible Epigenetic Mechanism. Molecules (Basel, Switzerland), 25(3), 609. 10.3390/molecules25030609

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[Researcher6076]

Research is out there if you look

Aina, F. O., Fadare, J. O., Deji-Dada, O. O., & Agbesanwa, T. A. (2021). Increasing Burden of Aging Population on Health Services Utilization: A Myth or Reality in a Country with Predominantly Young Population. Aging Medicine and Healthcare, 12 (2), 41–45. 10.33879/AMH.122.2020.07023

Al-dulaimi, S., Matta, S., Slijepcevic, P., & Roberts, T. (2024). 5-aza-2′-deoxycytidine induces telomere dysfunction in breast cancer cells. Biomedicine & Pharmacotherapy, 178 , 117173. 10.1016/j.biopha.2024.117173

Anisimov, V. N., & Khavinson, V. K. (2010). Peptide bioregulation of aging: results and prospects. Biogerontology (Dordrecht), 11 (2), 139–149. 10.1007/s10522-009-9249-8

Araj, S. K., Brzezik, J., Mądra-Gackowska, K., & Szeleszczuk, Ł. (2025). Overview of Epitalon—Highly Bioactive Pineal Tetrapeptide with Promising Properties. International Journal of Molecular Sciences, 26 (6), 2691. 10.3390/ijms26062691

Beard, J. R., Officer, A., Carvalho, I. A., Sadana, R., Pot, A. M., Michel, J. P., Lloyd-Sherlock, P., Epping-Jordan, J. E., Peeters, G. M., Mahanani, W. R., Thiyagarajan, J. A., & Chatterij, S. (2016). The World report on ageing and health: a policy framework for healthy ageing.10.1016/S0140-6736(15)00516-4

Bernardes de Jesus, B., & Blasco, M. A. (2013). Telomerase at the intersection of cancer and aging. Trends in Genetics, 29 (9), 513–520. 10.1016/j.tig.2013.06.007

Bernardes de Jesus, B., Vera, E., Schneeberger, K., Tejera, A. M., Ayuso, E., Bosch, F., & Blasco, M. A. (2012). Telomerase gene therapy in adult and old mice delays aging and increases longevity without increasing cancer. EMBO Molecular Medicine, 4 (8), 691–704. 10.1002/emmm.201200245

Bischoff-Ferrari, H. A., Gängler, S., Wieczorek, M., Belsky, D. W., Ryan, J., Kressig, R. W., Stähelin, H. B., Theiler, R., Dawson-Hughes, B., Rizzoli, R., Vellas, B., Rouch, L., Guyonnet, S., Egli, A., Orav, E. J., Willett, W., & Horvath, S. (2025). Individual and additive effects of vitamin D, omega-3 and exercise on DNA methylation clocks of biological aging in older adults from the DO-HEALTH trial. Nature Aging, 5 (3), 376–385. 10.1038/s43587-024-00793-y

Boccardi, V. (2025). From telomeres and senescence to integrated longevity medicine: redefining the path to extended healthspan. Biogerontology (Dordrecht), 26 (3), 107. 10.1007/s10522-025-10246-7

Chung, I., Osterwald, S., Deeg, K. I., & Rippe, K. (2012). PML body meets telomere. Nucleus (Austin, Tex.), 3 (3), 263–275. 10.4161/nucl.20326

de Jesus, B. B., Schneeberger, K., Vera, E., Tejera, A., Harley, C. B., & Blasco, M. A. (2011). The telomerase activator TA‐65 elongates short telomeres and increases health span of adult/old mice without increasing cancer incidence. Aging Cell, 10 (4), 604–621. 10.1111/j.1474-9726.2011.00700.x

De Vitis, M., Berardinelli, F., & Sgura, A. (2018). Telomere Length Maintenance in Cancer: At the Crossroad between Telomerase and Alternative Lengthening of Telomeres (ALT). International Journal of Molecular Sciences, 19 (2), 606. 10.3390/ijms19020606

Di Micco, R., Krizhanovsky, V., Baker, D., & d’Adda di Fagagna, F. (2021). Cellular senescence in ageing: from mechanisms to therapeutic opportunities. Nature Reviews. Molecular Cell Biology, 22 (2), 75–95. 10.1038/s41580-020-00314-w

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Yes, lots of research on aging. But only, Anisimov & Khavinson (2010) above included any reference to Epitalon, Right? And it was a review, not new research. And only Bischoff‑Ferrari et al., 2025 was an actual human trial and it was vitamins and exercise. For us "researchers" trying to decide if we want to give our subjects 10mg of Epitalon or a smaller dose, we have limited data to guide that decision.

 

[CNCCurrency]

Yes, lots of research on aging. But only, Anisimov & Khavinson (2010) above included any reference to Epitalon, Right? And it was a review, not new research. And only Bischoff‑Ferrari et al., 2025 was an actual human trial and it was vitamins and exercise. For us "researchers" trying to decide if we want to give our subjects 10mg of Epitalon or a smaller dose, we have limited data to guide that decision.